Signals from the Frontline #566: SoCal Open Cometh!

19 thoughts on “Signals from the Frontline #566: SoCal Open Cometh!”

1. The story you were telling at the start of the pod cast…

   It was my friend Matt who flew Stelek out to what was I think the very first Battle for Salvation out in Weschester New York. Challenged him on his site after various e-scuffles online and then paid for him to come out and play.

   After that, Stelek went to the first NOVA saying it was the best ever format because it wasn’t Yak 40k and Adepticon. Then got beat by Tony Kopach on his way to winning his first NOVA, and then NOVA was suddenly a shit non competitive format.

   Portent was the first major 40k forum site. It then effectively turned into Warseer when it shutdown. Which back then, Warseer was about 3-4x the size of Dakka.

   Dakka was where all the “neckbeards and rules lawyers” hung out and was considered the more “competitive” forum user base.

   Jesus Im old and remember way to much stuff that doesn’t matter.

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2. Thanks for sharing the story Marius 🙂

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3. Oh man, I remember reading about that years ago hahaha. Dakka was the only website I knew about way back after they shut down warseer. Some of the back and forth rules lawyering was kind if entertaining at first when I first read the forums, but then yeah, it got bad fast from some stubborn interpretations lol.

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4. About GW primers: some countries can’t get that. GW doesn’t ship to my country for example. The closest we can get is buying GW stuff from another retailer with 60 euro shipping for 1 can. Just FYI. We have to use army painter or other.

   About slow playing: you have 108 shots from Kastelans that you can split between units:
   “Ok, so I have this much, this unit will take 6 shots… this one will take 12…. this one will take 6….
   *5 minutes later*
   this one will take 6. Ok. Let’s go. Shooting at that one. Roll to hit. Re-roll. Roll to wound. Roll save. Roll FNP. Ok next one
   *10 minutes later*
   and FNP roll. OK. Only 10 more units to go”
   Basically – there are way too many dice to roll for the game to go fast for some armies.
   If you combine that with a horde army – yikes.

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   1. Well like he said when speaking of horde armies, it was the choice of the players who brought that army to do so and it is on them to learn how to do it quickly for the sake of their opponent.

      No one makes you bring a 6er of Kastellen Robots anymore so then 120 conscripts or 200 Orks. Those players who do have an intrinsic responsibility to know how to effectively operate those choices without detriment to their opponents timeshare of a game.

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      1. Yes, but tell me how is it possible to split 108 shots and roll them all fast, including enemy models shooting back sometimes or move 200+ models fast. I want actual advice on this.

         Because right now I’m seeing: “this list is awesome, it handles this, that, other but I can’t bring it because it will take too long to play and I won’t get enough pts”

         Again, I’m looking for actual advice. Random number generator for 108 dice? Giant plates to move all 30 models at the same time?

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         1. I’m not saying I’m using this list. It is a Horde list vs a Crap ton of split shots list.
            So at the end of the timer, you finish maybe 2 turns as both players need to either roll a ton of dice (as do most things in 8th for some reason) or move a ton of models(which if you move too fast and loose, the opponent will usually complain about you moving too much by accident)

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         2. Honestly, my suggestion would be to not bring a super horde army to any timed, singles event if you cannot manage to plan your moves and execute them without reasonable detriment to your opponents timeshare. I highly doubt the owner nor the opponent enjoy only progressing to turn two or three before time is called. So why subject themselves or their opponent to it? Movement plates won’t cut it the moment you want to stack up behind LoS blocking terrain and need to adjust the models to do so. Or stretch to protect/block units or avenues of movement.

            Large armies could be a option for a team event, though. Having two people to push the models around is a significant boost in speed and that format could better support that style of play in a timed environment.

            As for the Kastellen example, I don’t have any advice. If they are shooting 108 times, they are rooted. You will know what your target options are as the opponent movement phase progresses and the owner should be mentally assigning target priority and number of shots at that point. That way by the time shooting comes, its just throwing the dice you mentally allocated, allowing for contingencies. But that’s a player skill developed with experience. Not really much more I have to say on that.

            Again, we have to be responsible for ourselves and our limitations. I don’t bring 100+ model count armies because I would feel like a d-bag if my choice in play denied the game the ability to come to its natural end. Even if I was only half of the issue because I was paired with a similar match up.

            I’ve been playing 40k since 1994 and started the tournament scene with the GW Chicago GT in 2001 / 2. I know my limitations and my preferred play style. I’ve tried other styles and they just didn’t sync together. As much as I like the idea of playing hordes, I own it that I cannot do it in a singles timed environment to the level I think is fair to my opponent. So I own that, and I think others should as well. Not everyone’s methods and tools work for everyone else.

            This is of course, just my humble opinion and how my experiences have applied to me.

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            1. Let’s take orks for example. 90 boyz are right now almost mandatory.
               Tyranids: 60 various gaunts, 40 genestealers
               There are plenty horde armies that have been made for that playstyle – horde. Does this mean all of them are shunned because they will, understandably take a lot longer on their turns? Because right now, if there is a match between Nids and Orks, they will get less points not because they’re slow playing or are unskilled. But because they’re playing an army they want to play the way it is meant to play – swarms of nids, the green tide.

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            2. As I said, that’s all based on the player. If the player bringing those armies is incapable of getting past turn three because it takes them to long, then that player should probably re-think what they intend to bring to a timed singles event. Could be 90 models, could be 200. There is nothing more to be said, honestly.

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            3. Most horde armies will not make it past turn 3 in this timed scenario. With that said, Reece has already approved of players going into the lunch hour and there is 30 minutes before the next round starts to encourage trying to finish games. Other than that, have fice ready to roll and precounted. Im bringing ziploc bags so I dont have to count when shooting, and marking each bag with a number of dice inside. Micromanaging how you play has always been a thing in tournaments.

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            4. *shrug* I played a Renegades player last weekend who brought ten artillery pieces, fifteen Malefic Lords, and 120 infantry to the table. I, meanwhile, has psykers of my own, first-turn assaults, reserve units, and 100+ bodies on the table.

               We finished the game with time to spare. It’s entirely possible to play any army quickly, it just takes practice and skill. If you can’t do it, don’t bring that army to a tournament.

               (Also, if shooting with six Kastellans takes you ten minutes, you have a disorder. I don’t care how many rerolls you’re getting.)

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            5. Oh really.
               I roll to hit. Pick up failed to re-roll, I roll to wound, He rolls his save. He rolls his feel no pain(sometimes), he think about who he should shoot his guns at after death, he rolls to hit, he re-rolls 1s, he rolls to wound, I roll to save. Oh boy. 12 out 108 shots done.

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            6. Sounds like an extreme scenario against Noise Marines only.

               One in which the NM player should have had a good idea where they are going to retaliate when they are inevitably shot.

               I can only reiterate, as Abuse said as well, its a player issue. Its up to us as players to know what kind of armies we can handle in a timely manner.

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            7. >I roll to hit. Pick up failed to re-roll, I roll to wound,

               This whole part of the process should be twenty seconds, tops.

               >He rolls his save. He rolls his feel no pain(sometimes),

               Again, twenty seconds at the utmost.

               >he think about who he should shoot his guns at after death, he rolls to hit, he re-rolls 1s, he rolls to wound, I roll to save.

               Give it another 40 secs for this, and that’s being generous.

               All of that STILL gets you in under 10 minutes if you shoot every single Kastellan at a different target, which is not going to be common. If you need more than twenty seconds to roll and then reroll twelve dice, the problem is on your end, not on the game’s.

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            8. Well he was second guessing himself when picking targets with noise marines. Because he has multiple threats facing him

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5. I have been combing paint scores with battle scores at events i have been organising lately just to get the painting standards up again.

   I agree with you Reece when you say “people should not be punished for not being amazing painters” which is why the amount of points awarded is capped way lower than the max you can earn and anyone who did any serious effort will get max points. Everything is painted, shaded and the bases match? Good enough for me.

   I just really really dislike the ugly armies with borrowed non matching models and mono coloured sprayed stuff etc. People should put in some effort to have it look good.

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   1. That sounds like a fair system.

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6. I think even 14 for an Age of Sigmar GT would be appropriate. The community in the States is just not as big for Sigmar as 40k. I want to encourage more 2-day events, and I think even a smaller GT (in the teens of attendance) can be competitive.

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