Show Notes
Date
Intro
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News
- LVO extra 40k tickets down to 5 left! Wow, that went fast.
- Australian F.A.T. Mat Pre-Orders still a go and moving fast! Don’t wait to get yours if you live in Oz, some of them are already starting to run low on stock.
- Micro Art Studios releases some cool terrain, including these old school telephone booths.
- TGITG Show off a new Artillery Model.
- Bolt Action releases new Finnish Heavy Guns.
- Forge World releases a new, awesome model: Alexis Polux.
- Troll Forged shows off a new test Dreadnaught, and it looks cool!
Upcoming ITC Events
Rumors: The Rumor Section is gathered from the web and is not in any way information we receive from any manufacturer nor is it necessarily accurate. This section of the podcast is intended for entertainment purposes only.
- The next Endtimes book is rumored to be called Thanquol with a mini for him and a new Verminlord which would be cool. Also, Stormfiends, which are armored Ogre Rats, new Skaven Warlord and Grey Seer.
- Vermin Lord: 500pts, level 4 Wizard, and a host of new special rules.
- Necrons rumored to be coming at the end of Jan, with a clampack Character, some reboxings and a Codex.
- Rumors of a Codex: Harlequin supplement. Plastic boxes including new Harlie Jet Bikes called Sky Weavers. Supposedly in the February/March time-frame.
- Also rumors of a Deathwatch supplement, too!
- Dropfleet looks to have boarding actions as a part of the game.
Rant Session
Tactics Corner
- The new Kharn Formation looks pretty fantastic!
Rules Lawyer
- FW Knight Detachments
- BA Formation
Completed Commissions
List Review
++ Blood Angels: Codex (2014) (Formation Detachment) ++
+ (No Category) +
Detachment-source [Codex: Blood Angels]
+ Formation +
Angel’s Fury Spearhead Force
··Stormraven Gunship [Twin Linked Assault Cannon, Twin-linked Multi-melta]
··Stormraven Gunship [Twin Linked Assault Cannon, Twin-linked Multi-melta]
··Stormraven Gunship [Twin Linked Assault Cannon, Twin-linked Multi-melta]
··Tactical Squad [Heavy flamer, Meltagun, 9x Tactical Marine]
····Tactical Sergeant [Chainsword, Combi-Melta, Melta Bombs]
··Tactical Squad [Heavy flamer, Meltagun, 9x Tactical Marine]
····Tactical Sergeant [Chainsword, Combi-Melta, Melta Bombs]
··Tactical Squad [Heavy flamer, Meltagun, 9x Tactical Marine]
····Tactical Sergeant [Chainsword, Combi-Melta, Melta Bombs]
++ Blood Angels: Codex (2014) (Flesh Tearers Strike Force) ++
+ (No Category) +
Detachment-source [Exterminatus: Flesh Tearers]
+ HQ +
Librarian [Combi-Melta, Force Weapon]
··Warlord [Codex: Blood Angels]
+ Elites +
Terminator Assault Squad [Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield, 4x Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield]
Terminator Assault Squad [Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield, 4x Thunder Hammer and Storm Shield]
+ Troops +
Tactical Squad [Meltagun, 4x Tactical Marine]
··Drop Pod [Storm Bolter]
··Tactical Sergeant [Chainsword, Combi-Melta, Melta Bombs]
+ Fast Attack +
Drop Pod [Storm Bolter]
Drop Pod [Storm Bolter]
I’m surprised at the reaction to a turn one assault being unfair in a game where many armies turn one shooting is far more devastating than what the BA formation can inflict.
Well, with shooting you can hide, get a save, maybe folks are just used to the idea, etc. Assault is typically much more devastating in terms damage output. Plus its new, and “feels” wrong, so to speak. I don’t know how crazy it actually is in practice, and am fairly neutral on it at this point, personally.
I agree with that. It does have the potential to really hurt some common builds. The fact they were systematically taking all “assault from reserves” abilities out of the game makes it’s inclusion really odd.
It was also really funny to hear Mr. “Invisible Draigo Centstar with turn one Grey Knight formation” railing against it
“My army rapes you turn one with bullets, Incinerators and gravity instead of hammers so it’s all good”
Lol, fair enough. But the Ol’ Raw Dogger is known for his strong opinions on topics, haha.
My issue with turn 1 assaults are the nightmares of 3rd ed when blood angels rhino rush assaulted turn 1 and proceeded to sweep from assault to assault all game long lol…. So its more trauma for me than anything
Awesome show guys. Thanks for the list feedback. We’re pretty much having the same conversation in our local game group over the new raven formation. I may change things up just for civilities sake.
I am fairly neutral, personally. I like what it does to shake up the meta but I know folks will get really upset about it.
It feels icky, tbh. Every rule in the game that could result in a turn 1 assault, is set up to prevent it. Infiltrating, scout, reserves, etc. i think as you point out, it’s going to turn people off. IDK, all the things listed as OP are what prevent me bothering with serious tournaments. Mind you, maybe I should use the formations that take chaos to 11… Helbrute Murderpack!
Yeah, I agree. It feels wrong, will certainly upset people, but in the context of a purely competitive meta, it really does help to mitigate some of the more powerful stuff out there.
I’m not sure if that’s a comfort, or a further frustration.
In Australia we introduced a foreign toad to eat some grubs that were damaging our sugar cane crops, and the toads are way worse than the grubs ever were!
Yeah, Cane Toads! lol
Entertaining as always!
Thank you, sir!
Rawdogger: “I only play competitively, not firendly”
Then what are you doing playing deathwing
Lol!
Great podcast. As far as that BA formation I agree with Frankie it’s really expensive to field that formation and it depends on the army they play and all the other variables you discussed to make it brutal. I play tau Orks and chaos and for sure I don’t think my tau or Orks would have an issue against that formation, because my tau list runs a lot of interceptor and my goal is to get into assault with my Orks any way. So it seems that formation’s brutality level is dependent on its opponent and the army it faces.
Very good point. It really does depend on who is on the receiving end of it.
Great episode as always guys. I actually like the big bad BA formation. I don’t even play any Imperial armies but I think the infusion of Blood Angels into the meta would be very nice. I think it would scare the crap out of a lot of knight players and perhaps tone that done a bit.
The reason I’m cool with it is that I feel like my deepstrike without scatter Archon/Autarch/Wraithguard bomb is just as dirty and with far less of a tax placed upon it then the BA’s. There’s a dirty combo out there for all the armies (except perhaps Dark Angels, Chaos and Orks) and I wouldn’t want to take the Blood Angels one away. There so iconic and the formation is pretty dang fluffy. So I’m for it.
Been listening to this podcast – in particular about the BA formation issue, and I think that for the most part there are some issues with your group interpretation and enthusiasm. I don’t have the rule book and FAQs sitting here, but when I saw the formation for the first time, I had no issues…
1. IIRR Homers have to be on the table before a turn starts in order for them to be used on that turn. That means if the special BA formation enters the table on turn 1, drop pods cannot use them. Units entering from reserves are essentially occurring “simultaneously”.
2. IIRR, Homers don’t work in zooming flyers. The tactical squads may have to dismount (or the Stormraven change flight modes). You can drop out of a zooming Stormraven entering from reserves, but there are inherent risks of scatter. Not a big deal, but worth following up on. Otherwise you can “jump the shark” with the idea that after the first two Stormravens enter the table and are placed, that the tactical squad in the third Stormraven could “(ab)use the special rule” and drop on the table to go into assault…
3. I’d have to go back to the actual source materials and rules for the rest of the debate. It would seem that the special rule of this formation is cool, but, other rules preclude units that dismount from drop pods from actually assaulting that turn, whereas jump pack or teleporting (terminator) units don’t have that issue of dismounting. Special rules cannot overturn other rules unless they are specific enough to do so (I don’t recall the formation special rule specifically mentioning changing the “dismounting and assaults” base rule). Basic drop pods are not assault ramp vehicles. Drop pods are treated as open topped however (for damage purposes), as well as immobilized, once they are placed on the table and the ramps drop.
In summary, I don’t think this special rule mechanic impacts Turn 1, so it would effectively give your opponent a small measure of time to prepare for it. There may be other “abuse holes” however, like having skyshield landing pads…but I’ll leave that for another debate….
Interestingly, this formation may get me to purchase two more Stormravens….
The problem with what you saying is that the rule from the formation has noting to do with the rules from the teleport homer. So none of your points matter because they are completely separate things
For example if the rule said “all friendly BA units with in 12 inches of a model with a teleport homer in this formation gets feel no pain” would you try and say that the homer has to be on the table at the start of the turn to give out the formations effect?
The answer is no because they are two different rules that have nothing to do with each other
Teleport Homers totally work when inside a Zooming vehicle.
And with regards to #3, remember that the Drop Pod is an open-topped vehicle.
As an interesting reminder, teleport homers only work for units in Terminator armor. Why did they not use “Locator Beacons” instead, which work for any unit coming from deep strike reserve? Makes the discussion more interesting, acknowledging that the formation has the usual loose writing. Both homers and beacons only work if they were already on the table at the beginning of the turn. With that precedent, I’d say your attempt at first turn charges using the Auger Triangulation special rule would not be allowed in a game with me. Worse case, a FAQ would actually confirm that and say it only works for terminators because it is based on teleport homers totally changing the theory and your proposed army list. .
In the show notes above, the two extra drop pods are not needed? For the points, grab a “Flesh Tearer” Landspeeder…you can homer it in if needed. Can Flesh Tearers use the special rule from the BAs and are just different in name only? Or are they noted as different from BAs (like Ultras vs ImpFists)…
Without the Drop Pods the Terminators won’t be arriving Turn 1.